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Jared Israel Interviewed On BBC About Milosevic 'Trial'
Page set up by John Flaherty
[Posted 29 August 2002]
=======================================
The BBC's Bill Hayton interviewed Jared Israel on August 23rd. Excerpts
from
the interview were used in a BBC feature story which can be read at
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/world/europe/2220997.stm
The feature story is balanced for the most part. But it leaves out much
of
the interview. To hear the whole original interview on RealPlayer audio,
go
to http://emperor.vwh.net/Audio/bbc823.rm
Below Is Full Tanscript of BBC Interview
BBC - 23 August 2002
BILL HAYTON: Can I credit you as from the International Committee?
JARED ISRAEL: I'm the vice-chairman of the international committee. One
of
the vice-chairmen.
BILL HAYTON: Right
JARED ISRAEL: And I edit the website - www.icdsm.org
BILL HAYTON: Who do you think's winning in the courtroom?
JARED ISRAEL: Well, I think everybody thinks Milosevic is winning. The
question is whether it's a rigged battle. That is, if the fix is in, in
a
prizefight, it doesn't really, then, mean that because one person is
winning
that he will necessarily win, right? Because the judges have already
decided.
And the judge in this case is manifestly on the prosecution side. That
was
very clear on the 26th, on the last day's testimony when Mr. Markovic
was
asked by Mr. Milosevic, "Is it true that you were tortured?" And he
said,
"Yes." And judge May said this doesn't have any relevance to the
evidence,
which this witness has given here, none at all. Whether he was tortured.
Now that's a trial-stopping issue. In other words, it's our position
that,
since their main prosecution witness - because he's not in the KLA and
he's
not Paddy Ashdown, that is an operative of the British special forces
and the
special representative of the British government 10 times going to
Yugoslavia, and he's not one of the leaders of the Kosovo verification
mission, and he's not in the CIA and he's not therefore William Walker,
but
he was actually the leader of the Serbian security police - was brought
in to
testify and said he was tortured to give false evidence...that's what he
said....
BILL HAYTON: ....right
JARED ISRAEL: Now, how can you continue the trial then? And they
continued.
So the trial is now a dead thing walking. That is our position.
BILL HAYTON: I mean...you accept that war crimes were committed in
Kosovo...
JARED ISRAEL: Yeah, by NATO and the KLA on a grand scale
BILL HAYTON: But you're confident there were no war crimes committed at
all
by any Yugoslav security forces in Kosovo?
JARED ISRAEL: I'm not, nobody in the world could ever make a statement
like
that about any security force in any war.
And as a matter of fact one of the points that Milosevic and Rade
Markovic,
who was the leader of that force and who is the prosecution witness,
made is
that several hundred people in the army and I assume in the security
forces
were prosecuted by the Yugoslav government for committing atrocities.
Now. Does the fact that they prosecuted members of the security forces
and
the army for committing atrocities mean that there were no atrocities?
No, it
means there were. But, since that happens in every war, the crucial
question
is whether an army prosecutes those people who do such things. And I
would
hold that against the record of Britain in the Falklands [Islands]; I
would
hold it against the record of Britain and the US in Afghanistan. Who's
being
prosecuted for atrocities in Afghanistan? What pilots in the US, Britain
or
Germany were prosecuted for bombing civilians during the attack on
Yugoslavia? Why haven't Blair and Clinton been prosecuted for launching
an
aggressive war? But Yugoslav soldiers and members of the security
forces,
according to Rade Markovic, were prosecuted.
So, yes, of course, atrocities occur, but that is the opposite of an
official
policy of having them, isn't it? When you prosecute the people who do
it, you
discourage it.
BILL HAYTON: The prosecution is now trying to prove that the orders to
commit
those atrocities, such as they were, came from the top
JARED ISRAEL: But that would be remarkable, wouldn't it? To order people
to
commit atrocities and then prosecute several hundred people who did? As
far
as I know, one person was prosecuted in the Vietnam War for committing
atrocities. Two and a half million people were killed, atrociously.
BILL HAYTON: Ok, but...
JARED ISRAEL: Now in the case of Kosovo, when the US attacked the
country,
the only people who have been prosecuted for committing atrocities, were
prosecuted by Yugoslavia. Where has the US prosecuted anyone?
BILL HAYTON: Ok. So, do you think the prosecution has or has so far -
looking
at the trial - proved a link between Milosevic and the action of the
troops
on the ground ...
JARED ISRAEL: First of all, the actions of the troops on the ground,
from
everything that has come out in the testimony, have been remarkable and
a
model of how you combat terrorism without flattening the country as the
US
has been doing in Afghanistan - and mark you *not* it's own country -
whereas
this Kosovo *is* part of Serbia - that's point one. So, secondly, of
course
he's connected with the [action of the troops on the ground] - he was
the
head of the country - that doesn't mean that he oversaw every action.
But
[in] setting general policy, the president of the country is the
commander
and chief; in Yugoslavia, [he] is the commander and chief of the armed
forces.
Milosevic has not denied in fact he's affirmed that he had a large role
in
setting policy, he and the people who are also in the government with
him.
And one of the policies he set was to prosecute people who committed
atrocities.
Now, we have a book on the website I edit which is emperor's clothes at
www.tenc.net; we have a book written by two Yugoslav army generals,
including
Yugoslav army orders which are very strict in calling for the immediate
arrest of any soldier who violates the strict - the "treasuring" - and
they
use the word, "sacred" - of prisoners and the treasuring of civilians.
That's
the opposite of an official policy of persecuting and atrocities. So, in
answer to your question, yes there is a connection between Milosevic and
the
policies of his government, which includes the army.
---NOTE: The book, "The Other Side of the Story," can be read at
http://emperors-clothes.com/book/book1.htm
As for the specific command structure, no, he was not involved in
day-to- day
specific decisions about specific people; that's absurd.
So, I'm saying, number 1, what they're saying happened, didn't happen.
There
was not an official policy of atrocities. There was an official policy
of
opposing them. He was responsible, in part, for that policy. Therefore
he's a
hero. That's what they've shown so far. Their witness, their prosecution
witness, whom they tortured to get him to say Milosevic was guilty, came
in
and said this. And said he was tortured.
And Judge May said that's irrelevant.
You know what Gandhi said about Western Civilization? He said it would
be a
good idea.
BILL HAYTON: Ok. Thank you very much.
JARED ISRAEL: Thank you.
Join our email list at http://emperors-clothes.com/f.htm Receive
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http://emperors-clothes.com/audio/bbc823.htm
=======================================
EMPEROR'S CLOTHES IS IN URGENT NEED AND YOU CAN HELP!
=======================================
In order for Emperor's Clothes to continue publishing we urgently need
your
help. We rely entirely on contributions. We are behind on all our usual
bills, such as rent, paying our computer guru and phone bills. We are
also
about to produce a movie exposing the amazing media lies about the
imaginary
destruction of the old city of Dubrovnik. The video presents hard
evidence of
an orchestrated plan to turn world public opinion against the Serbian
people
by accusing the Yugoslav Navy of destroying historic Dubrovnik.
Remarkably,
one newspaper accused the Serbs of completely destroying the city...on
several different occasions.
And yet, despite this miracle of multiple total destruction, when Prof.
Petar
Maher shot video footage of the Old City in March 1992, it was still
standing, virtually unharmed.
If you would like Emperor's Clothes to remain standing, and to produce
this
important movie (on the lowest budget ever!) please help with a
contribution
of whatever you can afford.
Every contribution will help! $20, $50, $100, or more - or less. True,
more
is nice, but lots of less is good too. We know money is hard to come by,
and
when you contribute any of your hard-earned cash to Emperor's Clothes
you are
taking a stand against the brutal forces that are wrecking havoc on our
world.
Here's how to contribute:
You can make a credit card donation by going to our secure server at
http://emperors-clothes.com/howyour.html#donate
You can make a donation using PayPal at
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Or Mail a check to Emperor's Clothes, P.O. Box 610-321, Newton, MA
02461-0321. (USA)
Or make a donation by phone 1 617 916-1705.
Note: If you mail a donation or make one by secure server, please let us
know
by email at emperors1000@... to make sure we receive it. Thanks!
Thank you for reading Emperor's Clothes!
www.tenc.net * [Emperor's Clothes]
This Website is mirrored at http://emperor.vwh.net/ and at
http://globalresistance.com
Join our email list at http://emperors-clothes.com/f.htm
Receive articles from Emperor's Clothes Website
www.tenc.net * [Emperor's Clothes]
=======================================
Jared Israel Interviewed On BBC About Milosevic 'Trial'
Page set up by John Flaherty
[Posted 29 August 2002]
=======================================
The BBC's Bill Hayton interviewed Jared Israel on August 23rd. Excerpts
from
the interview were used in a BBC feature story which can be read at
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/world/europe/2220997.stm
The feature story is balanced for the most part. But it leaves out much
of
the interview. To hear the whole original interview on RealPlayer audio,
go
to http://emperor.vwh.net/Audio/bbc823.rm
Below Is Full Tanscript of BBC Interview
BBC - 23 August 2002
BILL HAYTON: Can I credit you as from the International Committee?
JARED ISRAEL: I'm the vice-chairman of the international committee. One
of
the vice-chairmen.
BILL HAYTON: Right
JARED ISRAEL: And I edit the website - www.icdsm.org
BILL HAYTON: Who do you think's winning in the courtroom?
JARED ISRAEL: Well, I think everybody thinks Milosevic is winning. The
question is whether it's a rigged battle. That is, if the fix is in, in
a
prizefight, it doesn't really, then, mean that because one person is
winning
that he will necessarily win, right? Because the judges have already
decided.
And the judge in this case is manifestly on the prosecution side. That
was
very clear on the 26th, on the last day's testimony when Mr. Markovic
was
asked by Mr. Milosevic, "Is it true that you were tortured?" And he
said,
"Yes." And judge May said this doesn't have any relevance to the
evidence,
which this witness has given here, none at all. Whether he was tortured.
Now that's a trial-stopping issue. In other words, it's our position
that,
since their main prosecution witness - because he's not in the KLA and
he's
not Paddy Ashdown, that is an operative of the British special forces
and the
special representative of the British government 10 times going to
Yugoslavia, and he's not one of the leaders of the Kosovo verification
mission, and he's not in the CIA and he's not therefore William Walker,
but
he was actually the leader of the Serbian security police - was brought
in to
testify and said he was tortured to give false evidence...that's what he
said....
BILL HAYTON: ....right
JARED ISRAEL: Now, how can you continue the trial then? And they
continued.
So the trial is now a dead thing walking. That is our position.
BILL HAYTON: I mean...you accept that war crimes were committed in
Kosovo...
JARED ISRAEL: Yeah, by NATO and the KLA on a grand scale
BILL HAYTON: But you're confident there were no war crimes committed at
all
by any Yugoslav security forces in Kosovo?
JARED ISRAEL: I'm not, nobody in the world could ever make a statement
like
that about any security force in any war.
And as a matter of fact one of the points that Milosevic and Rade
Markovic,
who was the leader of that force and who is the prosecution witness,
made is
that several hundred people in the army and I assume in the security
forces
were prosecuted by the Yugoslav government for committing atrocities.
Now. Does the fact that they prosecuted members of the security forces
and
the army for committing atrocities mean that there were no atrocities?
No, it
means there were. But, since that happens in every war, the crucial
question
is whether an army prosecutes those people who do such things. And I
would
hold that against the record of Britain in the Falklands [Islands]; I
would
hold it against the record of Britain and the US in Afghanistan. Who's
being
prosecuted for atrocities in Afghanistan? What pilots in the US, Britain
or
Germany were prosecuted for bombing civilians during the attack on
Yugoslavia? Why haven't Blair and Clinton been prosecuted for launching
an
aggressive war? But Yugoslav soldiers and members of the security
forces,
according to Rade Markovic, were prosecuted.
So, yes, of course, atrocities occur, but that is the opposite of an
official
policy of having them, isn't it? When you prosecute the people who do
it, you
discourage it.
BILL HAYTON: The prosecution is now trying to prove that the orders to
commit
those atrocities, such as they were, came from the top
JARED ISRAEL: But that would be remarkable, wouldn't it? To order people
to
commit atrocities and then prosecute several hundred people who did? As
far
as I know, one person was prosecuted in the Vietnam War for committing
atrocities. Two and a half million people were killed, atrociously.
BILL HAYTON: Ok, but...
JARED ISRAEL: Now in the case of Kosovo, when the US attacked the
country,
the only people who have been prosecuted for committing atrocities, were
prosecuted by Yugoslavia. Where has the US prosecuted anyone?
BILL HAYTON: Ok. So, do you think the prosecution has or has so far -
looking
at the trial - proved a link between Milosevic and the action of the
troops
on the ground ...
JARED ISRAEL: First of all, the actions of the troops on the ground,
from
everything that has come out in the testimony, have been remarkable and
a
model of how you combat terrorism without flattening the country as the
US
has been doing in Afghanistan - and mark you *not* it's own country -
whereas
this Kosovo *is* part of Serbia - that's point one. So, secondly, of
course
he's connected with the [action of the troops on the ground] - he was
the
head of the country - that doesn't mean that he oversaw every action.
But
[in] setting general policy, the president of the country is the
commander
and chief; in Yugoslavia, [he] is the commander and chief of the armed
forces.
Milosevic has not denied in fact he's affirmed that he had a large role
in
setting policy, he and the people who are also in the government with
him.
And one of the policies he set was to prosecute people who committed
atrocities.
Now, we have a book on the website I edit which is emperor's clothes at
www.tenc.net; we have a book written by two Yugoslav army generals,
including
Yugoslav army orders which are very strict in calling for the immediate
arrest of any soldier who violates the strict - the "treasuring" - and
they
use the word, "sacred" - of prisoners and the treasuring of civilians.
That's
the opposite of an official policy of persecuting and atrocities. So, in
answer to your question, yes there is a connection between Milosevic and
the
policies of his government, which includes the army.
---NOTE: The book, "The Other Side of the Story," can be read at
http://emperors-clothes.com/book/book1.htm
As for the specific command structure, no, he was not involved in
day-to- day
specific decisions about specific people; that's absurd.
So, I'm saying, number 1, what they're saying happened, didn't happen.
There
was not an official policy of atrocities. There was an official policy
of
opposing them. He was responsible, in part, for that policy. Therefore
he's a
hero. That's what they've shown so far. Their witness, their prosecution
witness, whom they tortured to get him to say Milosevic was guilty, came
in
and said this. And said he was tortured.
And Judge May said that's irrelevant.
You know what Gandhi said about Western Civilization? He said it would
be a
good idea.
BILL HAYTON: Ok. Thank you very much.
JARED ISRAEL: Thank you.
Join our email list at http://emperors-clothes.com/f.htm Receive
articles
from Emperor's Clothes Website
Send a link to this article to a friend! Go directly, or cut and paste
the
following URL into your browser:
mailto:ENTER FRIEND'S EMAIL ADDRESS HERE?subject=Here's a great article
from
emperors-clothes.com!&body=I just read the following article which I
thought
you would find most interesting. Here's the address:
http://emperors-clothes.com/audio/bbc823.htm
=======================================
EMPEROR'S CLOTHES IS IN URGENT NEED AND YOU CAN HELP!
=======================================
In order for Emperor's Clothes to continue publishing we urgently need
your
help. We rely entirely on contributions. We are behind on all our usual
bills, such as rent, paying our computer guru and phone bills. We are
also
about to produce a movie exposing the amazing media lies about the
imaginary
destruction of the old city of Dubrovnik. The video presents hard
evidence of
an orchestrated plan to turn world public opinion against the Serbian
people
by accusing the Yugoslav Navy of destroying historic Dubrovnik.
Remarkably,
one newspaper accused the Serbs of completely destroying the city...on
several different occasions.
And yet, despite this miracle of multiple total destruction, when Prof.
Petar
Maher shot video footage of the Old City in March 1992, it was still
standing, virtually unharmed.
If you would like Emperor's Clothes to remain standing, and to produce
this
important movie (on the lowest budget ever!) please help with a
contribution
of whatever you can afford.
Every contribution will help! $20, $50, $100, or more - or less. True,
more
is nice, but lots of less is good too. We know money is hard to come by,
and
when you contribute any of your hard-earned cash to Emperor's Clothes
you are
taking a stand against the brutal forces that are wrecking havoc on our
world.
Here's how to contribute:
You can make a credit card donation by going to our secure server at
http://emperors-clothes.com/howyour.html#donate
You can make a donation using PayPal at
https://www.paypal.com/xclick/business=emperors1000@...&no_shipping=1
Or Mail a check to Emperor's Clothes, P.O. Box 610-321, Newton, MA
02461-0321. (USA)
Or make a donation by phone 1 617 916-1705.
Note: If you mail a donation or make one by secure server, please let us
know
by email at emperors1000@... to make sure we receive it. Thanks!
Thank you for reading Emperor's Clothes!
www.tenc.net * [Emperor's Clothes]
This Website is mirrored at http://emperor.vwh.net/ and at
http://globalresistance.com